| View previous topic :: View next topic |
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
 |
|
 |
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
 |
|
Eupedia goes on to tell us:
| The origins of haplogroup R1b are complex, and shrouded in controversy to this day. |
Oooo!
| The present author favours the theory of a Middle Eastern origin (a point upon which very few population geneticists disagree) ... |
An Appeal To Authority?
| ..followed by a migration to the North Caucasus and Pontic Steppe, serving as a starting point for a Bronze-age invasion of the Balkans, then Central and Western Europe. |
Everybody loves a good migration.
| This theory also happens to be the only one that explains the presence of red hair among the Udmurts, Central Asians and Tarim mummies. |
Err, hang on mate .. just a paragraphs ago you told us something different.
| It is now almost certain that native Irish and Scottish Celts were taken (probably as slaves) to southwest Norway by the Vikings, and that they increased the frequency of red hair there. |
i.e. it's Slave Trade in red heads that spreading the DNA, not yer normal kind of "migration". Assuming that Slave Trade is an "unnatural" kind of migration, as opposed to the usual kinds implied by ortho-dogma.
Why doesn't Slave Trade explain the presence of red hair among the Udmurts, Central Asians and Tarim mummies?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
|
|
|
|
I hadn't thought about the slave trade and genetics. Presumably you don't allow male slaves to breed with native women and presumably you don't waste cargo space on slave women (nor do they turn up very much as prisoners of war).
The offspring of female slaves remain slaves so there must have been some. Since those children are born in ordinary ratios we can say there will eventually be an unlimited slave population but with a genetic bottleneck.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
|
|
| Mick Harper wrote: | | presumably you don't waste cargo space on slave women. |
For some slave traders, the opposite may have applied. Depending on the market.
| The Barbary slave trade involved the capture and selling of European slaves at slave markets in the largely independent Ottoman Barbary states. European slaves were captured by Barbary pirates in slave raids on ships and by raids on coastal towns from Italy to Ireland, coasts of Spain and Portugal, as far north as Iceland and into the Eastern Mediterranean. |
Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_slave_trade
From Morocco, they joined the Trans-Saharan slave trade route
| Slavery existed in Morocco since antiquity until the 20th century. Morocco was a center of the Trans-Saharan slave trade route of enslaved Black Africans from sub-Saharan Africa until the 20th century, as well as a center of the Barbary slave trade of Europeans captured by the Barbary pirates until the 19th century. |
Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Saharan_slave_trade
This now makes sense of something that puzzled me a while ago. One of the Eupedia maps of "red heads" had a hot spot in Western Africa, maybe somewhere near Timbuktu. It made no sense at the time, but forced migration via slavery trading might explain it.
I will now be puzzled where that map is.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
|
|
A vague memory is stirring of a vaguely related topic. How the first Christian Bishop got to be in England.
From the legendary Bede:
| Bede, an 8th-century monk who wrote a history of the English church, recorded a famous story in which Pope Gregory I saw fair-haired Saxon slaves from Britain in the Roman slave market and was inspired to try to convert their people. |
Quite why Pope Gregory I fancied fair-haired people remains unexplained.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
|
|
|
|
presumably you don't waste cargo space on slave women.
For some slave traders, the opposite may have applied. Depending on the market.
The Barbary slave trade involved the capture and selling of European slaves at slave markets in the largely independent Ottoman Barbary states. European slaves were captured by Barbary pirates in slave raids on ships and by raids on coastal towns from Italy to Ireland, coasts of Spain and Portugal, as far north as Iceland and into the Eastern Mediterranean. |
I don't see any mention of women.
From Morocco, they joined the Trans-Saharan slave trade route
Slavery existed in Morocco since antiquity until the 20th century. Morocco was a center of the Trans-Saharan slave trade route of enslaved Black Africans from sub-Saharan Africa until the 20th century, as well as a center of the Barbary slave trade of Europeans captured by the Barbary pirates until the 19th century. |
Still no mention of women.
| This now makes sense of something that puzzled me a while ago. One of the Eupedia maps of "red heads" had a hot spot in Western Africa, maybe somewhere near Timbuktu. It made no sense at the time, but forced migration via slavery trading might explain it. |
By pathogenesis?
A vague memory is stirring of a vaguely related topic. How the first Christian Bishop got to be in England. From the legendary Bede:
Bede, an 8th-century monk who wrote a history of the English church, recorded a famous story in which Pope Gregory I saw fair-haired Saxon slaves from Britain in the Roman slave market and was inspired to try to convert their people. |
No mention of women. They appear to be so rare in the slave trade, one would have thought they were worth mentioning.
| Quite why Pope Gregory I fancied fair-haired people remains unexplained. |
Quite a lot remains unexplained from your account, Borry. Not least why anyone would suppose the population of Britain is fair-haired. I know someone who lives there and he says they're brown-haired.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
|
|
|
Why are you so obsessed by the slave women?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
|
|
|
|
|
I was once obsessed by a brown-eyed handsome man but I can't remember what was on the flip side.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
|
|
|
Was it Van Morrison?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
|
|
|
|
|
Buddy Holly.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Boreades
In: finity and beyond
|
|
|
|
Ah yes.
Next time we meet Van Morrison, must remember to ask if his brown-eyed girl had red hair.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
The Library Index 
FAQ 
Search
Register
Profile 
Log in to check your private messages 
Log in 
