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Edwin Johnson (History)
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Hatty
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Good digging. Wiley is a worthy successor of Edwin.

I don't remember posting on 'Claudius of Turin' but the striking thing, now, is the lack of biographical info -- apart from info provided by, err, Claudius of Turin. Going by his reputation as a denouncer of the cult of relics etc., one would expect contemporary references to him to abound. Rabanus Maurus seems to be the only commentator who mentioned Claudius though he hardly counts as a (9th century) contemporary, the earliest edition of Rabanus' writings being dated 1627.
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Wile E. Coyote


In: Arizona
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Let's try another experimental Edwin post. Just to see if it creates some useful ideas.
Hats wrote:
Very little is known about Augustine of Canterbury; the sources are thin on the ground. Certainly there is no archaeological evidence of his abbey.

Agreed.
wiki wrote:
Following the Norman Conquest of England in 1066, William the Conqueror confiscated landed estates, but he respected Church property.[16] At St Augustine's Abbey, the Anglo-Saxon buildings were completely reconstructed in the form of a typical Norman Benedictine monastery.[8] By 1100, all the original buildings had disappeared under a Romanesque edifice. There was further rebuilding as a result of the great fire in 1168.[17] The fire's destruction accounts for the paucity of historical records for the preceding period.[18]

Leland it is believed uncovered a tenth century gospel prayer book at St Augustine’s Abbey, Canterbury. The book had been given to the monastery by King Athelstan. Leland presented it to King Henry, after having inscribed in it Latin verses that flattered both rulers.

https://bit.ly/3zSaTdz
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Wile E. Coyote


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It actually seems a bit interesting, when you game play it out a bit.

Maybe it's just me?

Let's hear your refutations.
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Mick Harper
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I can't see it. Yes, Augustinian Anglo-Saxon Canterbury is a fiction; yes the basics may be a medieval land grab; yes, the whole thing looks got up by the Tudors; but the only bit that really hit me was the presence of punctuation.

One of my pet things is that forgers are pretty good at avoiding anachronistic solecisms except when it doesn't occur to them that they might be. This all began with the churches-with-steeples on the Bayeux Tapestry when it never occurred to the fourteenth century embroiderers (hah!) that you couldn't have churches without steeples. Though actually you couldn't have them with in the eleventh century. Ditto, maybe, punctuation. Gissus some help.
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Wile E. Coyote


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Henry's Golden Gospels is another one for Edwin.

The script is thought to be the finest purple script in existence.

As readers will be aware on the basis of previous posts. The production of purple manuscripts died out during the early dark ages, only to be reinstated in the late, as golden times beckoned. Rather unusually the script is in a unique uncial, in gold leaf, and the work was undertaken by up to 16 scribes.

The provenance is that it is thought it was possibly created for the coronation of Otto in 983.

However, it later turns up an inventory of the library of Henry VIII of England. Mysteriously, in the second half of the sixteenth century, the arms of England and an inscription addressed to a prince were added.

Later still it was acquired by J. Pierpont Morgan.

https://www.themorgan.org/manuscript/76895

Strange the lack of provenance between 983 and 1542. The binding is English 18th Century.
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Mick Harper
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I am not sure whether it will help your case but here's an extract from a quiz in a recently printed, but not yet published, book

Question Three: France has finally got hold of the original definitive manuscript of Diderot’s Le Neveu de Rameau, the most famous work by one of the central figures of the Enlightenment. Did they
(a) create a special niche for it in the foyer of the Comédie-Française
(b) hand it over for safekeeping to the Bibliothèque nationale
(c) sell it to the Pierpont Morgan Library in New York?

Question Four: the Pierpont Morgan would have done better to have
(a) bought a Seine bridge
(b) asked the French for their money back
(c) at least have the decency to take the wretched thing off their shelves this minute and admit they’re a complete bunch of wallies who wouldn’t know a genuine eighteenth century manuscript if it came wrapped round Madame de Pompadour’s pompadour?
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Wile E. Coyote


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Wile E. Coyote wrote:
N R Scott wrote:
Now my general view is that linear time only begins ..when a man is turned into a god.

Wiley's view though is slightly different, that linear time starts when you have a god, and an "adopted" son of god. (i.e. lineage).


Harold Godwinson. He is son of a god.
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Mick Harper
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You're not the son of a layout artist though, are you, Wiley? If you were he'd be turning in his grave at the off-putting amount of white light. Why not resolve not to do it? Or do you prefer to be off-putting? I suppose you would since your dad was Aleister Crowley.
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Wile E. Coyote


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There you go.
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Mick Harper
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I find threatening to out spawn-of-Satanists often has the desired effect. Though of course they return to their devilish practices the moment one's back is turned. Remember the motto under our crest: "Eternal vigilance is not the purview of small-minded pedants but the duty of everyman."
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Mick Harper
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Here's probably one for you, Wiley. I was reading up on the CE (Common Era) and BCE (Before Common Era) and why people might use it instead of AD (Anno Domino) and BC (Before Christ) and I couldn't discover who the Common Era was supposed to be common to. I eventually discovered it meant "common" in the sense of "vulgar" and tracked back to the 16th, 17th centuries.

This made no sense. Only Christians used it and only high falutin' Christians at that. And anyway why is AD in Latin and BC in English? What is BC in other (Christian) languages? Something there, dunno what.
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Wile E. Coyote


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Mick Harper wrote:
And anyway why is AD in Latin and BC in English? .


Boro is your best hope. I think the ortho answer is that AD (Anno Domino) was a replacement of the earlier (Anno Diocletian), and attributed to Dionysius Exiguus, on the basis that Dionysus did not want to be reminded of a Roman Emperor that had persecuted Christians. BC (Before Christ) was a later invention of Bede.

CE is a much later invention, that Wiley (son of Crowley) reckons has found favour as western scholars want to show sensitivity to non christians who they hope will buy their books and pay to attend their universities.
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Hatty
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If BC was coined by Bede, it could have been a 17th century invention.

There is no original manuscript of Bede's Ecclesiastical History. According to the British Library the earliest copy of the work, the Moore Bede, was named for its owner, Bishop Moore (1646–1714)

The Moore Bede is the earliest extant copy of Bede’s Ecclesiastical History of the English People, the first historical account of the origins of the English people and the development of their Church.

No attempt has been made to date the manuscript, except stylistically

The Moore Bede is traditionally dated to 734–737 on the basis of the so-called Moore Memoranda, a series of chronological notes preserved on f. 128v. Although the validity of these (and similar notes in The Leningrad Bede) as evidence for the manuscript’s date has been challenged vigorously, the manuscript can be dated securely to the 8th century on palaeographic and codicological grounds.
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Mick Harper
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CE is a much later invention, that Wiley (son of Crowley) reckons has found favour as western scholars want to show sensitivity to non christians who they hope will buy their books and pay to attend their universities.

Let's call a spade a spade. We're talking about Jews at American universities. Just standard woke. That was my assumption too. But it came as a shock to find out that it was John Milton. Or, as Hatty would say, 'was it?' Incidentally, I suppose academics at French, German, Spanish etc universities must have as much difficult with 'Before the Common Era' as they did with 'Before Christ' though I'm sure they know, unlike me and and the Little Satan, that Anno Domini means 'the year of our Lord'. Anno Domino is Latin for 'takeaway pizza'.
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Wile E. Coyote


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wiki wrote:
In chronology and periodization, an epoch or reference epoch is an instant in time chosen as the origin of a particular calendar era. The "epoch" serves as a reference point from which time is measured.

The moment of epoch is usually decided by congruity, or by following conventions understood from the epoch in question. The epoch moment or date is usually defined from a specific, clear event of change, an epoch event. In a more gradual change, a deciding moment is chosen when the epoch criterion was reached.


Then there is a list.

Regnal eras
Further information: Regnal era
The official Japanese system numbers years from the accession of the current emperor, regarding the calendar year during which the accession occurred as the first year. A similar system existed in China before 1912, being based on the accession year of the emperor (1911 was thus the third year of the Xuantong period). With the establishment of the Republic of China in 1912, the republican era was introduced. It is still very common in Taiwan to date events via the republican era. The People's Republic of China adopted the common era calendar in 1949 (the 38th year of the Chinese Republic).

Pre-modern eras
Olympiads, the ancient Greek era of four-year periods between Olympic Games, beginning in 776 BC.
Ab urbe condita (753 BC), used in the Roman imperial period.
The Anno Domini or "Common Era" era, still in use with the Gregorian and Julian calendars today, marks the Incarnation of Jesus as calculated in the 6th century by Dionysius Exiguus.[1]
Anno Mundi (years since the creation of the world) as used in the Byzantine calendar (5509 BC).
Anno Mundi (years since the creation of the world) as used in the Hebrew calendar (3761 BC).[2][3]
The Islamic calendar counts "lunar years" by Anno Hegiræ (in the year of the hijra) or AH era (AD 622). The year count shifts relative to the solar year as the calendar is purely lunar. The official Iranian calendar (used in Afghanistan as well as Iran) also dates from the hijra, but as it is a solar calendar its year numbering does not coincide with the religious calendar.
The term Hindu calendar may refer to a number of traditional Indian calendars. A notable example of a Hindu epoch is the Vikram Samvat (58 BC),[4] also used in modern times as "national calendar" of Nepal and Bangladesh.
Buddhist calendars tend to use the epoch of 544 BC (date of Buddha's parinirvana)
.


You select an epoch-defining event, and combine it with an effective form of counting.

My own convention is that The Foundation Of The Roman Empire = The Year Of The Lord.

Try it, no, on second thoughts please don't. Students of The Mystery Religion love a good mystery, and what better mystery is there than that of the epoch-defining event. Let's not spoil their fun.
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