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In Calvaria, Land Of My Fathers (NEW CONCEPTS)
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Jeff Green



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And we were singing, in Calvaria, land of my fathers, ar hyd yr nos (all through the night).

The above song/chant (taunt?) is used by "welsh" sports fans on both a regional & national level. For the best part of 48 years, as a fan of Cardiff City and of "welsh" rugby, I have heard/sung it many, many times. A bilingual sports song/chant is interesting enough in itself but not nearly as interesting as the lyrical content. Calvaria (or Calvary) is also Golgotha of biblical infamy, where some chap, who was given the biblical (business) name of "Jesus" was apparently crucified (solstice-ised). Who were the forefathers of the "welsh" in relation to "Jesus" and his place of death? If history is accurate (as it occasionally is), a large part of "Wales" was inhabited by a cult/tribe referred to as the Silures. Sil = sac or seed - Ure doesn't need the "e". It appears that the seed (bloodline) of Ur (of the Chaldees) made a journey from Chaldea (the tail that wagged the Mesopotamian dog) to little old "Wales". The desciption of the Silures as swarthy corroborates a south to north relocation. The Chaldeans presumably operated along the south "Wales" corridor from the monastery on Caldey Island (off Tenby) to Caldicot (Monmouthshire) as well as making their mark in Scotland (Kirkcaldy). So did the "welsh" forefathers travel through Jesus' place of execution, en route to Blighty, in "some-area" of the Levant or did the "Jesus story" originate in their new home? Maybe my local Calvary Baptist church has the answer! It seems as if "the great unwashed" (terraces types) offer, albeit inadvertently, more real history than "the great unwise" (academic types).

p.s. If you research the song/chant, you will be misinformed that the "welsh" sing "hymns & arias". The "in Calvaria" bit is NEVER mentioned despite being clearly audible. The fact that it is extremely difficult to find any information on what is seemingly just a mundane sports song/chant suggests that we are dealing with a matter that is "above" the hoi polloi.
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N R Scott


In: Middlesbrough
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Given that it was the place where Jesus was executed, Calvary might be another kill or cut word - cal, kill, cull.

It brings to mind the word calve too, which also brings to mind cutting - a calf cut off from its mother, calf as in half of the leg, and calve as in ice calving - cutting loose a mass of ice.

Calf can also mean a small island, near a larger island. Which again could suggest the smaller one was cut off from the bigger. Maybe a nod to Mick's causewayed tidal islands.
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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Jeff Green wrote:
It appears that the seed (bloodline) of Ur (of the Chaldees) made a journey from Chaldea (the tail that wagged the Mesopotamian dog) to little old "Wales".


What evidence is there that "Ur" is in Mesopotamia? What evidence is there that "Ur" is in the place archaeologists tell us it is in?

Today, there are tours organized to visit the "city" of "Mycenae", yet five minutes study of the issue is sufficient to make clear that the whole thing is naught but a fairy-tale invented by Schliemann---and still everyone says it is so.
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Jeff Green



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Evidently there is no 'evidence' of Ur being in Mesopotamia or where archaeologists or historians tell us it is/was. There is no 'evidence' that Ur or Chaldea ever existed at all from an epistemological point of view. I'm here to learn and I fully accept Ishmael's point.

The consensus seems to be that the 'welsh' are later arrivals and I am trying to trace their origins. The possible Ur - Silure connection was intended to be seen as probing not pointing. For all I know, the 'welsh' may have come from T-Ur-key.

With regard to my initial post, maybe I should have put myself across more succinctly.

Thousands of 'welsh', at 3 different sport venues on the weekend (9/10 Nov.) sang; 'And we were singing, in Calvaria, land of my fathers, ar hyd yr nos'.

If (?) Calvaria = Calvary = Golgotha, who were the forefathers of the "welsh" in relation to "Jesus" and his place of death (in terms of what 'welsh' fans sing) ?
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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Jeff Green wrote:
For all I know, the 'welsh' may have come from T-Ur-key.

You won't get anywhere up that tree.

The word "Turkey" is just another form of the place name found the world over that I render as "Tzarkhan" or "Khantzar", meaning "zone-kin" or "kin-zone" --- otherwise known as "home".
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Boreades


In: finity and beyond
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Jeff

Have you checked-out the DNA profiling of where else in the world has the same kind of genetic makeup as Wales?

Or the linguistic profiling, of what other languages are similar to Welsh?

IIRC, both point down the Western Atlantic, through Basque areas, into the Med and further east.
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