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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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The 'stories' about Elagabalus bear the hallmarks of the 'stories' about both Caligula and Nero. It is difficult to believe that the Roman Empire was ruled by such people. It is less difficult to believe they were largely or wholly made up but by whom and how much later is probably the question.
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Wile E. Coyote
In: Arizona
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Wile E. Coyote
In: Arizona
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Nero Redivivus
Nero Redivivus Legend was a belief popular during the last part of the 1st century that Nero would return after his death in 68 AD. The legend was a common belief as late as the 5th century.[1] The belief was either the result or cause of several pretenders who posed as Nero leading rebellions.
Several variations of the legend exist, playing on both hope and fear of Nero's return. The earliest written version of this legend is found in the Sibylline Oracles.[2] It claims that Nero did not really die but fled to Parthia, where he would amass a large army and would return to Rome to destroy it.[3] |
The Parthians of course link to the eagles.
Dio Chrysostom, a Greek philosopher and historian, wrote "seeing that even now everybody wishes [Nero] were still alive. And the great majority do believe that he still is, although in a certain sense he has died not once but often along with those who had been firmly convinced that he was still alive."[4] Augustine of Hippo wrote that some believed "he now lives in concealment in the vigor of that same age which he had reached when he was believed to have perished, and will live until he is revealed in his own time and restored to his kingdom."[1] In later forms of the legend, among many early Christians, this legend shifted to a belief that Nero was the Antichrist.[1] |
In COIN we treat Redivivus as a widespread form of circular thinking. (not much different to a Marxist belief in revolutions) Scotty is right to be scared.
| Dio Chrysostom (/ˈdiËoÊŠ ˈkrɪsÉ™stÉ™m, krɪˈsÉ’stÉ™m/; Greek: Δίων ΧÏυσόστομος Dion Chrysostomos), Dion of Prusa or Dio Cocceianus (c. 40 – c. 115 CE), was a Greek orator, writer, philosopher and historian of the Roman Empire in the 1st century. Eighty of his Discourses (or Orations; Λόγοι) are extant, as well as a few Letters and a funny mock essay "In Praise of Hair", as well as a few other fragments. His surname Chrysostom comes from the Greek chrysostomos (χÏυσόστομος), which literally means "golden-mouthed". He should not be confused with the Roman historian Cassius Dio, nor with the 4th-century bishop John Chrysostom of Constantinople. |
Whenever Wiki claims personages should not be confused. Wiley does exactly that.
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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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I would think the real significance of Nero is that he allegedly blamed Jews/Christians (it is not always clear, or maybe I can't remember) for the Great Fire and persecuted them. This might be the first Roman (i.e. not Josephus) source for Christianity. Perhaps the Great Fire itself has some sun-worship connection.
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Wile E. Coyote
In: Arizona
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Circus of Nero
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circus_of_Nero#/media/File:Circus_of_Nero.png
The circus was the site of the first organized, state-sponsored martyrdoms of Christians in 65. Tradition holds that two years later, Saint Peter and many other Christians shared their fate. The circumstances were described in detail by Tacitus in a well-known passage of the Annals, (xv.44). |
The Circus was centred on a obelisk =sun worship
The earliest reference to Saint Peter's death is in a letter of Clement, bishop of Rome, to the Corinthians (1 Clement, a.k.a. Letter to the Corinthians, written c. 96 AD). The historian Eusebius, a contemporary of Constantine, wrote that Peter "came to Rome, and was crucified with his head downwards," attributing this information to the much earlier theologian Origen, who died c. 254 AD.[8] St. Peter's martyrdom is traditionally depicted in religious iconography as crucifixion with his head pointed downward.
Peter's place and manner of death are also mentioned by Tertullian (c. 160-220) in Scorpiace,[9] where the death is said to take place during the Christian persecutions by Nero. Tacitus (56-117) describes the persecution of Christians in his Annals, though he does not specifically mention Peter.[10] "They were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt." Furthermore, Tertullian says these events took place in the imperial gardens near the Circus of Nero. No other area would have been available for public persecutions after the Great Fire of Rome destroyed the Circus Maximus and most of the rest of the city in the year 64 AD. |
Peter's tomb is under the basilica as apparently Christians believed at that time they should be buried close to the area of their greatest suffering. So a Basilica was built over the Circus (still centred on the obelisk) with Peter underneath.
| Between 320 and 327, Constantine built a five-aisled basilica atop the early Christian necropolis that was purported to be Peter's resting place.[16] Much of the Vatican Hill was leveled to provide a firm foundation for the first St. Peter's Basilica. The altar of the Basilica was planned to be located directly over the tomb. The matter was complicated by the upper chamber or memoria above the vault. This upper chamber had become endeared to the Romans during the ages of persecution, and they were unwilling that it should be destroyed.[15] The memoria was turned into the Chapel of the Confession. |
It's amazing what you can do with a bit of goodwill on all sides....this explains the perplexing archaeology which shows Roman memoria over Peter's tomb, when we are supposed to have the Roman stuff below!
Unfortunately the Saracens intervene......
However, any treasures that may have been present at the tomb are presumed to have been taken by the Saracens during their Sack of the church in 846.[17]
The skull of Saint Peter is claimed to reside in the Basilica of St. John Lateran since at least the ninth century, alongside the skull of Saint Paul.[18] | |
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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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| However, any treasures that may have been present at the tomb are presumed to have been taken by the Saracens during their Sack of the church in 846. |
This hilarity is standard for explaining all missing archaeology (aka 'careful ignoral') though the writer at least has the honesty to include the word 'presumed'. Our own dear archaeologists use Vikings (or whoever) as the self-evident agents for disappearing stuff they can't find. (but know must be there). Of course 'treasure' might well be removed by Saracens. Vikings take the treasure and then erase the archaeology!
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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| Wile E. Coyote wrote: | | Sun worship was widespread through the empire, and Elagabalus decided he would instill the worship of his god by elevating Elagabal the sun god to the level of Jupiter, which was bad enough......he built a temple to Elagabal on Palatine Hill, had himself circumcised, and then danced around the altar of his god naked in front of the senate. In another somewhat insensitive move he moved sacred relics of the Roman religion to this newly built temple so that all Romans wanting to worship had to worship Elagabal. In short he did not grasp the concept of a multi faith empire. |
This is Akhenaten again!!! AKA Henry VIII.
| His personal life was a bit of a mess, Elagabalus married and divorced five women... |
Henry VIII!
James I
| ...and offered vast sums of money to any physician who could give him female genitalia. |
And I suspect reflective of the conflation of James and Elizabeth. This is just a suspicion however.
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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Emperor Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus = Caesar Augustus = Akhenaten = Henry VIII
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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| he stone was housed in the Elagabalium built on the east face of the Palatine Hill, where our emperor danced naked.... |
And there, finally, is the connection with King David (the eighth son of Jesse), who famously danced through the streets of Jerusalem!
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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| But the archaeology the huge black meteorite has gone missing. |
There is one in Jerusalem. It's housed within the Dome of the Rock.
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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| The Circus was centered on a obelisk =sun worship |
So is St. Peter's Basilica.
And that obelisk has associations with the sun and with the Golden Ratio that I am not at liberty to divulge.
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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Peter = Penis? Peter is the Obelisk. The Obelisk is the hitching post of the sun and that is the rock upon which Christ founds his church.
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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| ...and offered vast sums of money to any physician who could give him female genitalia. |
Elizabeth I, as head of the English Church, was the first female Pope. First = John (Juan / One). Feminine version of John = Joan. Elizabeth is Pope Joan. A Pope/King with female genitalia.
It is by the same route that Elizabeth I, in the guise of the heretic Elizabeth Barton, becomes Joan of Arc. Or should I say, Joan of Ankh? For the Egyptians knew her as Ankhessenpatten, daughter of Akhenaten.
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Wile E. Coyote
In: Arizona
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Wile E. Coyote
In: Arizona
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