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Megalithic concrete (Megalithic)
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Boreades


In: finity and beyond
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Here's another subject that really upsets the Trad. Archeos.

In the 1980's, Joseph Davidovits proposed that some of the Pyramids is build from geopolymer concrete. At first he was ridiculed, but now, following rigorous analysis, it is reasonably substantiated.

See http://www.ancient-wisdom.co.uk/constructiontechniques.htm#concrete

It would be interesting to see if there is any equivalent of Portland in the Carnac area, for the production of cement and concrete megaliths.

Archeologists, in the narrowness of their specialty, would have trouble seeing any difference between ancient concrete and any other stone they find.

Geologists will say any strangely straight-edged rocks underwater in old harbours are just rocks with naturally-occurring fault lines.

Historians will say there's no written evidence.

What would AE-folk say?
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Hatty
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In: Berkshire
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Archaeologists poo-poo wattle and daub as a durable material too.
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Mick Harper
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Since wattle-and-daub has been mentioned and as a mild protest against Mr Boreades' tendency to open new threads with the regularity that some of us open our bowels ie every few days, here's a new review of The Megalithic Empire

Published in Northern Earth 132, Winter 2012-13, p.28.

THE MEGALITHIC EMPIRE
M.J. Harper & H.L. Vered
Nathan Carmody 2012. Hbk, 253pp. £19.95. 978-0-9542911-1-2

Here is a bold and curious book about the prehistory of Britain. It starts from plausible premise, namely that during the Neolithic and Bronze Age, there was a widespread trading network in a number of exotic goods throughout Britain and Europe. In itself, this is not controversial.

Many academics believe the same thing. The writers of this book go much further and suggest the early commerce was directed by a huge multinational monopoly which controlled the movement of goods by the maintenance of a network of 'old straight turnpikes' called, of course, leylines. This cartel, the Megalithic Empire of the title, collected tolls and in return maintained the route system and aided in navigation both on land and sea.

They were also sole players in the hospitality industry and developed a warehousing system. They constructed megalithic monuments for the purpose of encouraging and profiting from trade. This arrangement supposedly continued for several millennia (monopolies are noted for stifling innovation) until they were put out of business by the expansion of the Roman Empire.

Rather than coming to an accommodation with the Romans, the organisation went underground. It is suggested that the Megalithic Empire became Druids, Culdees, Cistercians, Templars, Rosicrucians, Freemasons, etc. etc., but not the more obvious turnpike trusts. What advantage these people thus gained isn't clear.

As may be expected, these wide-ranging claims are backed up with a selection of supporting facts and arguments. However, some of the thought processes on display here are very strange indeed. Perhaps the best way to describe this is to look at one of the oddest ideas - their theory of hillforts, advanced in a chapter called 'Megalithic Terraforming'.

It begins with the controversial statement that the last Ice Age erased all previous topographical features, leaving the landscape as a 'blank slate'. Many authors have used this idea as a metaphor, but these seem to take it literally. As for hillforts, they point out some pitfalls in the idea that they were purely defensive structures. For a start, their size makes them difficult to defend. Also, their hilltop location presents access problems.

So they suggest their own idea. First, they point out that wattle-and-daub is an excellent building material (so good that no-one uses it anymore). They speculate that its remarkable properties were probably discovered when animals were corralled together, churning up the mud, straw and dung etc., forming a natural daub.

The next prop for their theory is the idea that prehistoric livestock traders would need somewhere to keep their beasts safe for the night. For this, the Megalithic Imperialists built earthwork corrals, resulting in their floors becoming covered in this natural daub, which protected them from erosion. Outside, the land eroded away leaving the animal folds isolated on their hilltops. They appear to believe that land can erode that quickly and that daub can resist wind and rain for centuries.

That, so far as I can make out, is their theory of hillforts. If you think that's plausible, then this is the book for you. If you are shaking your head and muttering 'bonkers', then this is probably best avoided. It is perhaps unfair to judge a book by its most extreme idea, but most other concepts are on this spectrum somewhere.

Of course I could be totally wrong about this. The whimsical tone and eccentric notions that pepper this book could indicate that it should in fact be regarded as a proficient parody. Perhaps this is 1066 and all that for the Vicky Pollard generation. In which case, this is brilliant. I had a smile on my face as I read it and had several good belly laughs. This could in fact be a laser-sharp satire on woolly thinking and pointless conspiracy theories. [MH]
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Boreades


In: finity and beyond
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Sorry if I've upset some unspoken rule on how to be included in this playground. If new threads are not approved of, I'll stop.
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Mick Harper
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They are neither approved nor disapproved. You are requested first to find some existing thread to hang your new hat on and only then to open a new one. A new Boreades thread should be something we all look forward to.
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Boreades


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Probably my fault then. I did try using the Search facility for "concrete" but was confused by the results giving me no clues whether I was looking at anything related or recent. Hence taking the liberty of starting a new thread.
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Mick Harper
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When using the Search facility, newbies should be warned that the default mode is to give the searcher only the threads that include the term, and which is completely useless. This is unlike every other forum's search facility which gives you the precise post. There is a little button at the bottom whereby you can switch from thread to post manually but it took me several years to notice it.

As you might expect we have begged the powers-that-be (the software engineers who created and maintain this site) to alter this but they always refuse on the grounds that software engineers hate and despise civilians and will do anything to inconvenience them.
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Hatty
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Is Northern Earth's readership representative? A mixed bag, religiously speaking, according to their findings:

A reader sends this in re the 2011 Census:
<Overall, in England and Wales, 56,620 Pagans account for 0.1 per cent (cf 0.3 per cent Jedi Knights ). The Pagan tally goes up to around 80,000 if you add in all the other variants.>
In NE's home terriitory, <One person in Calderdale identified as Shinto, 253 as Pagan, 2 as animist, 5 are Shamans (!), 8 Satanists, 13 Pantheists,1 New Age (!), 2 Thelemites, 73 Wiccans, 20 Druids, 10 heathens, 6,192 'no religion'.>


I thought the exclamation marks signified surprise (or scorn?), now I've no idea what they mean. I had to look 'Thelemites' up on Wiki but only had enough patience to read the first sentence

Thelema ( /θəˈliːmə/; Koine Greek]) is a spiritual philosophy or religion[1] that was developed[2] by the early 20th century British writer and ceremonial magician, Aleister Crowley. He came to believe himself to be the prophet of a new age, he Æon of Horus,[3] based upon a spiritual experience that he and his wife, Rose Edith, had in Egypt in 1904.
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Mick Harper
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I think somebody ought to start a concrete thread.
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Hatty
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Strangeways

If you look up les traicts de Croisic (on the French Atlantic coast), you will find they are described as 'une zone d'estran' which roughly translates as strand in English.

It seems rather a complicated intertidal zone, covered and uncovered at high and low tides, but somehow, despite the worst that the Bay of Biscay can throw at it, the strand or foreshore seems as strong as any concrete wall. Which reminds me, according to French etymologists, estran in Picardy is stranghe or estranc; in Dutch, the master dyke-builders, strang.
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Mick Harper
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Well yes, strand does seem to have a peculiar etymology and lotsa Megalithic implications. If we take the most well-known use of the word, The Strand, the leftbank of the Thames leading into the City of London, we have the meaning of 'an artificial water bank', with the implications that some strengthening procedures or properties were used therein. Including hydrological engineering.

The Strand of course is part of the A4, the main Megalithic route from Bath via lotsa significant places. Also the site of The Savoy built by John of Gaunt, a notable Megalithic figure (according to TME anyway). Savoy itself was a Megalithic state.

This water/land interface meaning of strand is only applied in limited situations, not necessarily recognised by orthodoxy but should be by us.

The other meaning of strand (though clearly connected as being long and thin) is the fibre of textiles, another Megalithic biggie.

Stranding ships (on beaches) is of course literally the way the Megalithics habitually landed their cargoes.
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Mick Harper
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Geologists will say any strangely straight-edged rocks underwater in old harbours are just rocks with naturally-occurring fault lines. Historians will say there's no written evidence. What would AE-folk say?

This AE folk would say that a simple stroll along Chesil Beach with a thingy-thingy would reveal large boulders underneath. Unlikely if it is natural. Then a quick dig would reveal the still preserved chisel marks on the boulders and a geological scan would reveal they came from the Chausey Islands.

Not that it would make the slightest difference because the sea also makes chisel marks (we now know eg at Chesil Beach) and granite boulders often float across the Channel where they get lined up due to longshore drift. Whereupon they mostly get covered by sand, pebbles etc.

If no boulders are found under Chesil Beach it will make no difference either because ( ... I'll think of something).
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Hatty
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I was wondering if clay, which when wet is sticky and extremely heavy, is the reason why the Megalithics built tidal causeways. It shares the same etymology as glue and is famously the building material of divine choice. Dry clay becomes brittle and cracks, clearly a problem if its purpose is to bind a structure together. Assuming you have a working knowledge of tides and currents a tidal causeway could be the perfect solution.

It goes without saying that pottery was widely developed, not confined to Megalithic areas. Slightly at a tangent, China's ceramic industry lead independently to tin-bronze production without the intermediate stages that occurred in other parts of Europe and the Middle East. Tin and kaolin also co-exist in Cornwall where china clay production is quite modern, not surprisingly since the proportions of kaolin ingredients are as exact, and secret, as tin-bronze. Chinese pottery was and still is highly specialised and they are also renowned for great buildings!
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Hatty
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The Megalithic forum is temporarily inaccessible due to a tide of spam so feel free to post on AEL in the meantime. Otherwise, Keimpe advises waiting 24 hours. He is a rock of sanity in the shifting sands.
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Wile E. Coyote


In: Arizona
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The Bosnian Pyramids were in part built of concrete.

http://www.bosnianpyramids.org/

It seems that the Bosnians are convinced, even if academia and your Egyptologists remain doubtful.
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