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Who birthed the Renaissance? (NEW CONCEPTS)
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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Ok. I just looked this up.

I believe you have just opened quite a can of wurms. And not the one you meant to open.
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Angus McOatup


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Angus McOatup wrote:
Mick Harper wrote:
From The Megalithic Empire's point of view, the most interesting thing about Clemens was his passing:

Margaret Clement died on 6 July 1570, the anniversary of More's execution, and was buried in St. Rombout's cathedral [Mechlin] in the Grote Markt. Clement himself died on 1 July 1572 in the year that the Spanish sacked the ancient imperial town, and was buried beside his wife near the high altar of the cathedral.

For both husband and wife to be buried near the high altar of a cathedral is an astonishing honour for such an apparently obscure couple. St Rombout of course is one of the chiefiest of the Megalithic saints.

...Indeed Mick....

...Though not so astonishing if this 'John Clements' were of noble birth, and if his aunt was Margaret of York (Duchess of Burgundy) whose Court was based at Mechelen ?


Sorry for the confusion.....The idea is that John Clements was one of the 'Princes in the Tower' who was kept alive and given a false identity by dark forces potentially hostile to the new tudor regime, should a regime change be warranted. From an AE perspective these dark forces operating behind the throne could be conceived as being a sort of Plantagenet Megalithia Inc? This would explain why 'John Clements' was accorded a noble burial a Mechelen at St Rombold's

I got all ( although not the megalithic speculation -) from

http://www.holbeinartworks.org/

sadly the author of this website has passed away, but check it out and see what you think?
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Angus McOatup


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Ishmael wrote:
Angus McOatup wrote:
Holbein's sketch of The More Family...and 'Rowland Lockey's' painting of The More Family (now at Nostell Priory)....


What is the relationship between these two works? Was the painter working from the sketch?

Isn't it customary for the painter to be the one to make the sketch for his own work?


The relationship is that the sketch was for a painting now lost. The 'Rowland Lockey' is actually another name for Holbein who made a copy for the More family after they had fallen from favour. Holbein has included john Clements in the picture ie Prince Richard to show future generations (that's us BTW) what exactly was going on. Also there are dozens of clues in the picture. they are called homophonic rebus's, and shed light cryptographically on the goings on. Check out the website. Its not easy stuff though...
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Angus McOatup


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Ishmael wrote:
Ok. I just looked this up.

I believe you have just opened quite a can of wurms. And not the one you meant to open.


...Now I'm puzzled ?
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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Identify Moore's Fool.

Now I will tell you his name.

His name is Dionysus.
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Ishmael


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Going through the author's material, I came across this gem:

The impression is that : (1) The Sun is a symbol of the royal house of York. (2) The mystery man is a Duke of York, marked by a hidden perpendicular from the arc of the sun's corona (a symbol carried on the personal arms of the second son of the English kings : i.e. the Duke of York). (3) Someone has just died, since the curtain is drawn, the emblem shows a black eclipse and Thomas More is oddly unshaven (symbols of 'death' and 'mourning').
-- Sir Thomas Moore and the Princes in the Tower


Surprisingly, the author missed this:

"The Victorians had a lot of superstitions associated with death. When there was a corpse in the house you had to cover all the mirrors," she said. "And if a mirror in your house was to fall and break by itself, it meant that someone in the home would die soon. When someone died in the house and there was a clock in the room, you had to stop the clock at the death hour or the family of the household would have bad luck.
-- Civil War Era Mourning


I remembered this because, in Newfoundland (where I was born), this remains our tradition; all the mirrors are covered; all the clocks are stopped.
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Ishmael


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This Web site is a perfect study in AE, illustrating again for us that principle recently mentioned; for every bad idea, there is an equal and opposite crazy idea. This is the crazy idea.

The bad idea is orthodox history.

The author has hunted a conspiracy that does not exist, in an attempt to solve an historical mystery that likely never happened, by reference to persons who probably never lived.

But in so doing, our conspiracy has uncovered clues to the real mystery (well...sadly...I can only characterize this material as clues to the existence of a real mystery---as its solution evades even we who are aware of it).
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Ishmael


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Examination of the open book on Margaret Roper's lap (right foreground) shows two pages of Seneca's Oedipus and that Margaret is pointing, unmistakably, to the word 'Oedipus'....Oedipus solved the riddle of the Sphinx and the name is sometimes given to persons good at solving puzzles.

Unmentioned by the author...



The Sphynx would appear to be seated at the feet of Thomas Moore, the conquered trampled by the conqueror.
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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The Web site has lots of valuable information concerning anomalies in the painting. Nevertheless, the author is clearly bat-shit crazy.

One must wade through paragraphs of nonsense to find one nugget of golden reason.
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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Who is Moore's fool?

Standing at ease in Holbein's sketch next to the young John More, and behind Cecily Heron, is a broad-countenanced man, in a frontal pose resembling the one often associated with Henry VIII.
-- Sir Thomas Moore's Fool

Unmentioned by this source: The pose in question is associated with Henry VIII in large measure due to the work of the very same artist who has here depicted the family of Thomas Moore. The pose of Moore's Fool is, in fact, the very mirror image to that of Holbein's portrait of Henry VIII. Surely the likeness of bearing is deliberate.

Especially considering the likeness of.....well....likeness!

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Hatty
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In: Berkshire
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Could this be a self-portrait?

Hans Holbein

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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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All variations on the same theme.
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Angus McOatup


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Ishmael wrote:
Who is Moore's fool?

Standing at ease in Holbein's sketch next to the young John More, and behind Cecily Heron, is a broad-countenanced man, in a frontal pose resembling the one often associated with Henry VIII.
-- Sir Thomas Moore's Fool

Unmentioned by this source: The pose in question is associated with Henry VIII in large measure due to the work of the very same artist who has here depicted the family of Thomas Moore. The pose of Moore's Fool is, in fact, the very mirror image to that of Holbein's portrait of Henry VIII. Surely the likeness of bearing is deliberate.

Especially considering the likeness of.....well....likeness!


More's fool is Henry Patterson who has been dressed up to look like Henry VIII, but he's in far from jocular mood....'John Clelments' looks sadly across to 'Henry' because he, Richard Plantagenet is the rightful heir, also because at this time Richard's brother, the other Prince aka 'Sir Henry Guildford, has passed away ie the clock has stopped....yes..it's not easy stuff, but the painting is contemporary with events and must be taken as reflective of such events, as it so blatantly departs from the 'orthodox' sketch.

Hatty your observation is also very interesting...

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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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How is it that I associate Moore's Fool with Dionysus?

For now, that remains a secret.

However, I will point out that Moore's Fool shares yet another characteristic with Henry VIII.

Their names.

Moore's Fool was Henry.

Henry Patenson.
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Ishmael


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Angus McOatup wrote:
'John Clelments' looks sadly across to 'Henry' because he, Richard Plantagenet is the rightful heir, also because at this time Richard's brother, the other Prince aka 'Sir Henry Guildford, has passed away ie the clock has stopped....


You don't seriously believe this stuff, do you?
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