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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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That's so clever. Wish I'd thought of it!
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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How does it work???
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Ishmael
In: Toronto
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The frog, as we learned from Jurassic Park, will sometimes turn from female to male.
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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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Well, let's see. Hermes 'marries' Aphrodite. I take that to mean that Hermes (ie the domestication method) requires Aphrodite (ie virgin birth). This, I have just found out, in certain circumstances is actually a method of infinite propogation in birds, where the egg does not require sperm to produce chicks (which are all male...it's a long story).
But why these offspring should require Salmacis is beyond me. This is what's known:
In Greek mythology, Salmacis was an atypical naiad who rejected the ways of the virginal Greek goddess Artemis in favour of vanity and idleness. Her attempted rape of Hermaphroditus places her as the only nymph rapist in the Greek mythological canon.
"There dwelt a Nymph, not up for hunting or archery:
unfit for footraces. She the only Naiad not in Diana's band.
Often her sisters would say: 'Pick up a javelin, or
bristling quiver, and interrupt your leisure for the chase!'
But she would not pick up a javelin or arrows,
nor trade leisure for the chase.
Instead she would bathe her beautiful limbs and tend to her hair,
with her waters as a mirror." | |
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Lazy then, perhaps parasitic. Mistletoe?
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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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Alternatively, Hermes ('the propagator of the herds') takes the virgins (ie all the young females) and then uses them for domestication ie to produce animals that are not natural but just sit around in pampered idleness. Until they are taken off to be slaughtered ....er... what happened to Salmacis?
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| nemesis8 wrote: | [Four horses stuck in a bog;
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Wild guess..............
Four horses of apocalypse?
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Gardeners like frogs because they control water-pests. Frogs as guardians of the sacred lotus has a certain cachet.
They (frogs, not gardeners) have very fast sticky tongues to catch insects. Somewhere I read there are depictions of Cernunnos aka Hermes with followers chained to his tongue by their ears. Hermes was the god of eloquence.
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Salmacis was the name of a fountain which according to Ovid people believed had the effect of making men effeminate, presumably the pool in which the Hermaphrodite story took place. It may be just a legend as Ovid thought, or the water had been 'softened'.
Apollo had a son called Aristaeus who was the god of fruit trees, bee-keeping and various agriculture-related specialties so clearly the role of bees in pollinating fruit was known. Perhaps Apollo is the root of pollen.
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| nemesis8 wrote: |
What is it? The gaping wide-mouthed waddling frog.
Buy this of me:- What is it? Two pudding ends will choke a dog,
With a gaping, wide-mouthed waddling frog.
Buy this of me:- What is it? Two monkeys tied to a clog,
Two pudding ends will choke a dog, etc.
"The answer to the last question stood as follows:-
"Twelve huntsmen with horns and hounds,
Hunting over other men's grounds;
Eleven ships sailing o'er the main,
Some bound for France and some for Spain;
I wish them all safe home again;
Ten comets in the sky,
Some low and some high;
Nine peacocks in the air,
I wonder how they all came there,
I do not know and I don't care;
Eight joiners in joiner's hall
Working with their tools and all.
Seven lobsters in a dish,
As fresh as any heart could wish;
Six beetles against the wall,
Close by an old woman's apple stall;
Five puppies by our bitch Ball
Who daily for their breakfast call;
Four horses stuck in a bog;
Three monkeys tied to a clog;
Two pudding ends would choke a dog;
With a gaping wide-mouthed waddling frog." |
I can't agree with these classical references (ugh) this is just the stuff we like to sing about on the south coast, namely our deep hatred of Catholics the Frogs and the Spanish (it's ironic the, I wish them all safe home again), we also hate the Irish, rich proud and powerful and err foreigners. It really is impressive that we have crammed in so much hatred and bile. It would be be great for bonfires. Of course it's been politically cleansed into the twelve days.....
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Agreed, Nate, it's tricky analysing or trying to make sense of 'nonsense' songs, nursery rhymes, etc. presumably full of topical humour as in panto. Christmas carols seem to have been regarded as fundamentally pagan by the Puritans who banned them though they were not anti singing per se, of the more pious sort.
Have the French always been called Frogs?
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Well Liz is supposed to have called a french diplomat Frog.
However I had just posted and then I thought of Witch and that sort of clicked alot more (gaping wide mouthed... I am not adding to my PC credentials but I reckon its a possibility) as we have a proud record in hating witches in these parts as well. Looking at the bright side we still have the French in at the start, so that makes it even more paronoid.
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Something I've thought odd about Apollo (sorry Nate) is his epithet of 'Mouse-Apollo', not a very lordly title even for a 'Lord of Mice'. Darwin found that bee-hives were raided by mice which is something else I've thought odd.
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Hatty
Site Admin
In: Berkshire
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Pursuing the hunting theme, I'm wondering why 12th August is the start of the grouse shooting season. Was it picked as a convenient date for Victorian gents to get to the highlands or an older tradition?
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Mick Harper
Site Admin
In: London
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In case you thought The Magic Flute was Mozart's only Megalithic opera, think again. Don Giovanni, it turns out, is none other than Hermes! He first pops up in 1630 as El burlador de Sevilla y convidado de piedra (The Trickster of Seville and the Guest of Stone), The modern rendition of the legend is the play Don Juan Tenorio which is performed in Spain every year on.... wait for it.... November the First, Samhain.
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