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The Flu (Health)
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Ishmael


In: Toronto
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To explain Wuhan City, you must ask yourself if there is any other case where the same phenomenon has been observed. Same effect; same cause.

Though not a precise match, the disaster in Bhopal, Madhya Pradesh, India in 1984 is the only other place and occasion, outside of wartime, where members of an urban population fell over dead en masse. A rational investigation of the mystery of Wuhan City should begin, therefore, by presuming that the effect observed there, to the extent that it was the same as what was observed in Bhopal, was spurred by the same cause. We can allow for differences in causation to the extent that the effect differed.

That's where the investigation must begin. With that presumption. That is Applied Epistemology.
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Grant



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But what evidence is there that hundreds fell down en masse? Wuhan is a large city and I’m sure people drop down dead every day. But did hundreds drop down in one place like they did in Bhopal?
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Ishmael


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Grant wrote:
But what evidence is there that hundreds fell down en masse? Wuhan is a large city and I’m sure people drop down dead every day. But did hundreds drop down in one place like they did in Bhopal?


How many times, since 1984, have there been any reports of massive numbers of people falling dead in the streets of a major city? How many times since 1984 has there been video circulated worldwide of hundreds of people falling faint or dead in the streets of a major city?

If this is hysteria, it is hysteria without precedent. But if it is real, it most certainly does have a precedent. One precedent. That's enough for Applied Epistemology to posit a presumptive explanation.

This has happened before. And it wasn't hysteria the last time.
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Ishmael


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On the other hand, hysteria is a viable explanation. I don't want to shoot that proposal down. My own hypothesis begs credulity. It has only one thing going for it: The rules of reason.

I would say that the burden of proof falls on those who would say this was not a real event and that it was not due to the same cause responsible for its only historical precedent. But that doesn't mean that the alternate hypothesis is wrong.
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Ishmael


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Grant wrote:
But did hundreds drop down in one place like they did in Bhopal?


No. The deaths were distributed, seemingly at random. But, as I said, the nature of the cause is allowed to differ to the same extent to which the effect differs.

So we have the same cause. Poisoning. But we alter that cause just enough to explain the difference in effect.

Chemical poisoning becomes radiation poisoning and the distributed nature of the deaths is fully accounted for by the distributed nature of the radiation source: A source that is 100% capable of producing the reported deaths. That is not hypothetical or speculative. Microwaves will cook people as surely as they do popcorn.
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Chad


In: Ramsbottom
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Ishmael wrote:
In the US, a study was conducted of stored blood from December 2019 from blood banks. Every one of the 39 samples of stored blood tested by the CDC was positive for the C19 antibodies.

This doesn’t ring true. There was a similar study in Italy that found evidence of antibodies from some stored samples from earlier in 2019, but it certainly wasn’t a 100% hit.

If the first 39 US samples all showed C19 antibodies, this would be revelatory (and unprecedented in the history of research into any known virus) so why stop at 39, why not test a nice round 100 or even 50?
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Chad


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Ishmael wrote:
Chemical poisoning becomes radiation poisoning and the distributed nature of the deaths is fully accounted for by the distributed nature of the radiation source: A source that is 100% capable of producing the reported deaths. That is not hypothetical or speculative. Microwaves will cook people as surely as they do popcorn.

Has there ever been an established case of anybody ever dropping dead or suddenly collapsing from radiation poisoning, in the vicinity of a cellphone tower?

If not, then this just looks like one conspiracy theory being used to prop up another, and that is not good AE... especially when simpler explanations also fit the evidence.
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Mick Harper
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one conspiracy theory being used to prop up another, and that is not good AE

Not sure that's right. It is acceptable as a starting point surely? And Ishmael has advanced supporting evidence (of sorts). It is though interesting that the evidence itself is not always propping itself up. I get the impression that the two friends-of-friends are now something of an embarrassment.
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Chad


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Chemical poisoning becomes radiation poisoning

Why not take the simpler option, and stick with chemical poisoning?

Every time an outbreak occurred, men in hazmats (and even road tankers) could be seen spraying everyone and everything with some unknown chemical.
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Ishmael


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Chad wrote:
Has there ever been an established case of anybody ever dropping dead or suddenly collapsing from radiation poisoning, in the vicinity of a cellphone tower?


Would we recognize it if we saw it? It would only strike us as strange if it happened in sufficient numbers. Lots of cases of people dropping dead mysteriously though. I wonder how many had bedrooms on the wrong side of their houses.

There have, however, been cases of people being made seriously ill by microwave radiation. The US Embassy in Cuba was recently supposed to have been subjected to radiological attack and a reported incident in China too.

So no. Outside of Wuhan, radiation from improperly installed cellphone towers has never resulted in video evidence of people falling over dead in massive numbers.

On the other hand, there are suspicious cases of birds falling dead. And caught on video doing so. And, if I am to be honest, it was those videos---posted by 5G conspiracy theorists---that gave me the initial idea. I thought of Union Carbide afterward. 5G is a distraction. Improper installation is sufficient to explain the isolated cases needed.

It would be interesting to investigate whether cellular equipment at the US Embassy was actually to blame for the symptoms experienced by the staff. It may be that the US Military set up equipment that was not adequately shielded and ended up making their own people sick. That seems more likely than the Cubans suddenly deciding to commit an act of war.
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Ishmael


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Chad wrote:
Why not take the simpler option, and stick with chemical poisoning?


Because the characteristic of Wuhan City that makes it most unique is that it was the test-bed for Huawei's new 5G Network.
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Chad


In: Ramsbottom
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China’s three main providers went live with their 5g networks (in Wuhan and other major cities) on the 1st of November last year, but the infrastructure was up and running as far back as August... months before people started to drop dead in the streets of Wuhan.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50258287
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Ishmael


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Chad wrote:
China’s three main providers went live with their 5g networks (in Wuhan and other major cities) on the 1st of November last year...


And you don't find that date interesting.

but the infrastructure was up and running as far back as August... months before people started to drop dead in the streets of Wuhan.


Maybe. Maybe the infrastructure was up. But, given the above date, I think it questionable exactly what "running" means.

BTW - I hadn't even checked the dates before. The thesis was just too good to risk self-refutation. But holy smokes thank you!
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Ishmael


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Chad wrote:
Ishmael wrote:
Every one of the 39 samples of stored blood tested by the CDC was positive for the C19 antibodies.

This doesn’t ring true.


And yet it is.
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Chad


In: Ramsbottom
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Maybe. Maybe the infrastructure was up. But, given the above date, I think it questionable exactly what "running" means.

It is precisely this three month period (from August to the service going live on the 1st of November) when heavy testing was ongoing, that the conspiracy theorist blame for the degradation of the population’s immune system.

You (as far as I know) are the only person who is suggesting that just after the service went live (though the network itself had been humming away for three months) the shielding suddenly fell off the transmitters, and the poor buggers were microwaved to death.
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